13. What Does ‘Top 5%’ on Listen Notes Actually Mean?

What are the listen scores and global rankings on listen notes? And, do they actually mean anything? In today's episode, I'm diving into my recent top 5% ranking, and doing some informed speculation about what goes into the algorithm.

How to Leave a Review on Apple Podcasts 

Register for the Podcasting 101 Workshop: February 19 - 23, 2024. 

Join us to:

• Craft a detailed profile of your ideal listener (beyond the surface-level demographics)
• Break your overall topic down into content pillars and episode-specific ideas
• Determine the best format & frequency for you
• Strategically choose the name of your show
• Pick your launch date and lay out a strategic plan for your best chance of making the Apple Charts

Thinking about starting a podcast? Grab my free Podcast Roadmap: 7 Questions to Start Your Journey at www.ThePodcastTeacher.com/roadmap

This episode was produced by me, The Podcast Teacher! Contact me at Hello@ThePodcastTeacher.com.

Transcript

Hey hey and welcome back! Today, we’re going to talk about a top 5% ranking on Listen Notes, what that means, and how to get there. 

Two weeks ago, I was at Podfest expo and one of my clients was also there. We took advantage of the time together to talk about re-branding her podcast, and I was doing some competitor research using the podcast directory, Listen Notes. 

Listen Notes describes itself as “the best podcast search engine.” You can look up podcasts on there and you can also listen right on that platform, similar to how you can listen on Apple or Spotify. It’s just another option. 

So anyway, since I was already on the site, I decided to quickly look up my podcast just to see if anything had changed. I do not keep close tabs on my stats at all, and it had probably been over a month since I looked at it on Listen Notes.

I was shocked to see that Podcasting for Introverts was rated as a top 5% podcast! The podcast just turns 2 months old today, so it hasn’t been very long, and my downloads are not crazy high, so I was pleasantly surprised and a bit confused as to how being in the top 5% globally was possible. 

In today’s episode, I’m digging into what that number means and sharing some speculation into how I think I achieved that. I did reach out to Listen Notes to see if I could get any additional information about the algorithm, but I have not received a reply after 7 days, so I’m just going on what information is available on their website and my industry experience.

If you want to check your info, just head to listennotes.com and search for your podcast. 

Ok, so my podcast shows a global rank of the top 5%. According to the little info button next to my ranking, Listen Notes says that means quote “This podcast is one of the top 5% most popular shows out of three million two hundred eighty-three thousand fifty-one podcasts globally, ranked by Listen Score (the estimated popularity score).” unquote. 

We’ll dig into the Listen Score part in a moment, but I first want to address the 3 million plus podcasts. This is counting podcasts that simply exist, not active podcasts. 

Since there are a lot of podcasts out there that were started but aren’t being continued, that 3 million number contains a lot of inactive podcasts that are basically dead weight. 

So, global rank is a bit skewed, and therefore the top percentage is a bit inflated. Listen Notes tells me that I am in the top 5% of all podcasts, which includes dead podcasts, and those drag down the data. If they excluded the dead podcasts and only compared among active podcasts, I would definitely not be in the top 5%. 

Some podcast gurus will tell you that the Listen Notes global rank is worthless because of this. And I disagree. 

I think that continuing to persevere when SOOOO many podcasters quit, is something to be celebrated. Beating out millions of people who couldn’t handle it IS an achievement. 

Of course, it is just one data point in a sea of different metrics, but that doesn’t mean it’s not valid. The number is exactly what it says it is - the top 5% out of the 3 million plus podcasts that it’s counting. 

Its worthiness can be debated by those who care to get into the weeds, but only podcast industry professionals are the ones getting into the weeds. No one else cares that much! 

So, if you’re talking to the general public, the ranking is a marketing tool. It’s street cred. It opens the door for an audience who may not have otherwise given you a chance. 

Ok, so we’re going to take a closer look at how the ranking is determined in just a moment, but before we do, I want to invite you to my free Podcasting 101 workshop that’s happening the week of February 19th. 

I ran this workshop in January and I got some stellar feedback, so it’s going to become a somewhat regular thing, whenever I can find a spot to squeeze it into my schedule. 

If you’re an aspiring podcaster but you don’t know where to start, you can’t seem to turn your ideas into actions, or you just need someone to guide you, head to thepodcastteacher.com/workshop to grab your seat in this free workshop. You’ll receive lots of helpful info, plus personalized support from me inside the private, pop-up community. Hope to see you there!

Now, back to the Listen Score, which is the point of comparison to determine the global ranking. 

According to Listen Notes, the Listen Score is quote “a metric that shows the estimated popularity of a podcast compared to all other rss-based public podcasts in the world on a scale from 0 to 100.” Unquote. The score is updated approximately every 30 days. 

And in repsonse to the question How is the score calculated, on their FAQ page, the answer is quote “We developed a mathematical model to calculate a Listen Score for each podcast, based on the 1st party data (e.g., activities on our website) and 3rd party data (e.g., media mentions, reviews...).” unquote. 

That doesn’t really tell us a whole lot, unfortunately. Like I mentioned earlier, I did contact them inquiring about more specific info, but I did not receive a response. 

So, I’m going to examine the info from two of my clients who are at very similar place with their podcasts to see if I can speculate about what’s making the difference. Despite having very similar metrics, one podcast is ranking on Listen Notes, and the other is not. I’m going to call these clients Rachel and Monica to keep them anonymous and as a not so subtle reference to my favorite TV show, Friends. 

Rachel’s podcast is ranking in the top 10% on Listen Notes with a Listen Score of 26. 

Then, we have Monica, whose podcast is not ranking and no listen score is available - listen notes only publishes Listen Scores for the top 10% and above. So, Monica could be 1 point away or 25 points away from Rachel, we don’t know.

Rachel and Monica have been podcasting for a similar amount of time, released a similar number of episodes, and have a similar number of total downloads.

So, I’m very curious as to why Rachel’s podcast is ranking, and Monica’s is not.

Both podcasts each have a whopping ONE podcast download from Listen Notes - that was probably me testing each of their podcasts at the time of setup.

So, when Listen Notes says that one of the factors for the Listen Score is 1st party data - e.g. activities on their website - Rachel and Monica’s podcasts have equal listening activity. 

We can’t know how many people are looking up each podcast without playing episodes, but given the data that we do have, I’m going to say that these podcasts are on equal footing when it comes to 1st party data. 

The other category for the listen score is 3rd party data, and they specifically call out media mentions and reviews. 

Neither Rachel or Monica has had any media mentions. 

In terms of reviews, Rachel has eight 5-star reviews on Apple Podcasts and Monica has five 5-star reviews. This is the first real difference between the two podcasts, as minor of a difference as that may be.

Now, after calling out media mentions and reviews as examples of 3rd party data that factors into the listen score, there’s a dot dot dot,, implying that there are other factors that they’re not specifying.

They could be factoring in ratings in addition to written reviews. Neither podcast has any ratings on Spotify. Rachel has 10 ratings on Apple Podcasts, and Monica has 7. Again, a minor difference, but something that does align with Rachel ranking, and Monica not.

They could possibly be factoring in download numbers, though I’m not sure what their source of that information would be since the download numbers for an individual podcast are not public information. 

Perhaps Apple and Spotify agreed to share numbers with Listen Notes, I don’t know. 

Rachel has 788 total downloads and Monica has 882. But Rachel is the one who’s ranking, and she has fewer total downloads than Monica, so that doesn’t really line up. 

The only obvious difference is that Rachel’s podcast has more 5-star ratings and reviews than Monicas. And, ratings and reviews are public knowledge, unlike downloads. 

I repeated this same process of comparing my data and a 3rd client’s. I’m ranking in the top 5% with a listen score of 30, and she’s ranking in the top 10% with a listen score of 24. I’ll spare you and I won’t list out all of the data points, but I’ll summarize and say that again, the only slight difference was that I have more 5-star ratings and reviews.

There are so many variables that we don’t have the answers to and I’m sure that the fancy algorithm behind the scenes is quite complex, so this is pure speculation, but from the limited information at hand, it seems that ratings and reviews could play a significant part in the listen score.

Which is very interesting because Apple specifically states that ratings and reviews are NOT factored into their chart rankings. 

Anyway, if you’re still listening, thank you for sticking with me during what turned into kind of a nerdy episode. 

To summarize everything, I think that the listen notes global rank is worth paying attention to, celebrating, and using in your marketing. And I’m speculating that the number of 5-star ratings and reviews are important for increasing your listen score and therefore your global rank. 

I’d love to test that theory…if you’re on Apple, would you please take a moment to leave a 5-star rating and review? I’ll link some instructions in the episode description in case you aren’t familiar with how to do that. Then, I can report back in 30-ish days and tell you if my listen score increased.

Thanks so much, and I’ll talk to you soon!